THAT Suggestion

[Toni0]

What do you want to be changed?

Revert to CGC economy.

 

Explanation of suggestion?

Reverting to CGC price points, more consistent price scaling for faction and public vendors, MUCH better prices for resources like adhesive, better scaling for recyclers/money printer stuff, better looting prices, and more consistent melee vendor prices.

 

How or why does this benefit the server?

The current economy is flawed for SEVERAL reasons. 

1. Inconsistent high end price points scaled between each other and also scaled with armor. In most cases, Power Armor costs 20-25% what a high end would cost and most high ends do not exceed 50k, due to the 100k tax it would be horrible for them to exceed that.

2. Server inflation is WAY to chaotic and the economy is an utter mess as is. Auctions especially show this as an issue. A gun one month would cost 200k, one month later it costs nearly 1m without a buff. It is problematic and shows how this "deflated" economy has done nothing to fix anything. It is also a much bigger gap between the rich and poor.

3. Low end items like crafting resources and low end weapons have horrendously bad price gaps. If you get a pistol frame or something like a R91 frame you'd like to craft and you buy all of the resources needed for it from the public vendors you craft it. Then going to sell it you will make less than what it cost you. In some cases the vendor gives you half of what it cost to craft the weapon. With an inflated economy this wouldn't be an issue, more money means more gaps for scaling prices.

4. Inconsistent vendor prices have plagued the community. Melee vendors and frame/bp vendors don't have enough gaps to properly reflect rarity and lootability. Melee prices also fluctuate on a very regular basis for some reason which wouldn't be an issue in a CGC economy.

5. For some odd reason, when "deflating" the economy, many things were not "deflated". Crafting resources were doubled in price, most core faction money methods got nerfed by less than 5 caps despite it supposed to being cut by 35-50%, and due to the very bad deflation balance choices, melee weapons were either cut in half or not touched at all.

Why swap over?

1. Guns would have more "stock" like prices. For example, in CGC a weapon like the Caster cost 1.5 m at the beginning of 5.0. In the last month of 5.0 you would likely be able to get it at auction for a good price of 250-400k. This gap in price happened within a point of a year or so of wipe, including supply and demand. On here these kinds of auction prices would happen fluctuate on a VERY regular basis, leaving no consistency in prices. On here, the Caster went for about 500k one auction, 450k the next, then another 500k, to then a staggering 100k. With little room for the economy to grow or for people to express ways to make money, the same people get the same stuff and the more of a gap there is between the rich and poor. Same could be said with a handful of other weapons as well on here like the Gauss Rifle or Grenade Rifles being 2 other huge examples.

2. The CGC economy has lasted almost 3 years in a single wipe. It works. On here the economy has little spread or fluctuation for anything that is not a high end for both selling and buying, making everything else useless unless its a money printer. Also on Divide somehow things reach CGC levels of prices somehow despite being "deflated"?? Seems odd because its been so well baked in apparently.

3. Power Armor prices on CCG were reflected much better. On Divide, Power Armor prices are flawed, T45 and T51 have little to no difference in terms of price due to the little gap in the economy with how prices can go. The same can be said between T51 and T60 as well for some factions. 

4. Big numbers. People like being rewarded with big numbers. We all have brain rot.

5. Better looting dynamics. Melee weapons are slightly more viable to sell without being too much of an issue, and frames are more worth crafting because a single sheet of steel doesn't cost 20 caps for some god forsaken reason.

6. This current economy is a failure at cutting down on people being rich. There are enough people I can count on 2 hands that have made hundreds of thousands of caps for their factions in just days of grinding. 

7. Mugging will feel more rewarding and the standard cap set of 3500 will feel better but not too bad for the person being mugged either.

Edited July 16, 2024 at 07:14 PM by Toni0

[Deadshot]

+1

Economy is fucked. Fix it, Tonio, my boy.

[Zy0n]

+1 I liked having big numbers in my bank on cgc

[Marski]

ehhhhhhh

[Cat - Lon]

whole post is just dumb... from a developer preceptive. nothing here is actionable intelligence or useful information this is a bitching crying fit. 

Edited July 18, 2024 at 05:15 PM by Cat - Lon

[Toni0]

On 7/18/2024 at 1:13 PM, Cat - Lon said:

whole post is just dumb... from a developer preceptive. nothing here is actionable intelligence or useful information this is a bitching crying fit. 

 

Tell me how and why this economy is successful. 

[Rocky2]

On 7/18/2024 at 5:13 PM, Cat - Lon said:

whole post is just dumb... from a developer preceptive. nothing here is actionable intelligence or useful information this is a bitching crying fit. 

That my friend is because almost nothing requires a "developer preceptive" the suggestion is to change vendor prices, because we're going to a new map you have to do a lot of that anyway.
The "actionable intelligence" is changing the prices you sell/buy items in waster vendors to their CGC counterparts and increase F1 buy prices considerably the only "developer preceptive" is changing the bank limit from 100k to 1mil
Just because you're special doesn't mean the suggestion doesn't make sense. If you had more than 1 neuron firing you would get it

[ThunderWolf]

The economy is essentially inflated because of items for the most part; changing the economy to CGC's economy changes nothing. It simply has to to do with the fact that a LOT of players managed to get items so easily and the rest of their money goes to essentially nothing. If this changes, this just further divides the common player from the veteran for who gets what as arguable this benefits merchants getting MORE money than what they current have on hand.

 

-1. You're doing this post waayyy to early, especially given your other suggestions pertaining to changing stocks and such. Wait until the server is ACTUALLY up before suggesting something such as this. And I looked over all your reasons, all of them as various other reasons as to why the current economy was a "failure". But if you're not willing to take my word for it, then by all means, I'd be glad to explain them all to the class.

[ThunderWolf]

On 7/20/2024 at 11:52 AM, ThunderWolf said:

The economy is essentially inflated because of items for the most part; changing the economy to CGC's economy changes nothing. It simply has to to do with the fact that a LOT of players managed to get items so easily and the rest of their money goes to essentially nothing. If this changes, this just further divides the common player from the veteran for who gets what as arguable this benefits merchants getting MORE money than what they current have on hand.

 

-1. You're doing this post waayyy to early, especially given your other suggestions pertaining to changing stocks and such. Wait until the server is ACTUALLY up before suggesting something such as this. And I looked over all your reasons, all of them as various other reasons as to why the current economy was a "failure". But if you're not willing to take my word for it, then by all means, I'd be glad to explain them all to the class.

Here is your list in question, quotes proven through your list with various defensive explanations that counteract your claims:

On 7/15/2024 at 9:10 PM, Toni0 said:

5. For some odd reason, when "deflating" the economy, many things were not "deflated". Crafting resources were doubled in price, most core faction money methods got nerfed by less than 5 caps despite it supposed to being cut by 35-50%, and due to the very bad deflation balance choices, melee weapons were either cut in half or not touched at all.

The first 4 seemed reasonable but arguably to have it revert to CGC's economy is a bit to strung out, however in terms with "Reason 5", the issue stemed from the fact that vendor prices weren't generally fixed. This was already suggested that the melee vendor should've been fixed, but the problem here is the fact that Devs simply neglected the vendor.

On 7/15/2024 at 9:10 PM, Toni0 said:

1. Guns would have more "stock" like prices. For example, in CGC a weapon like the Caster cost 1.5 m at the beginning of 5.0. In the last month of 5.0 you would likely be able to get it at auction for a good price of 250-400k. This gap in price happened within a point of a year or so of wipe, including supply and demand. On here these kinds of auction prices would happen fluctuate on a VERY regular basis, leaving no consistency in prices. On here, the Caster went for about 500k one auction, 450k the next, then another 500k, to then a staggering 100k. With little room for the economy to grow or for people to express ways to make money, the same people get the same stuff and the more of a gap there is between the rich and poor. Same could be said with a handful of other weapons as well on here like the Gauss Rifle or Grenade Rifles being 2 other huge examples.

You already made the stock suggestion prior, as of this date of me typing this, SC hasn't even gotten to this (IDEFK why.). If you forgot, don't worry, because I found the link to your prior suggestion post here below:

Again, with the server not fully up, it's difficult to see whether your stock idea is the only resolvable idea to actually deflating the economy. Changing it to CGC's without even knowing the massive changes they'll do it practically overkill if you're wrong.

 

On 7/15/2024 at 9:10 PM, Toni0 said:

4. Big numbers. People like being rewarded with big numbers. We all have brain rot.

I don't and this is a fucking stupid reason.

On 7/15/2024 at 9:10 PM, Toni0 said:

5. Better looting dynamics. Melee weapons are slightly more viable to sell without being too much of an issue, and frames are more worth crafting because a single sheet of steel doesn't cost 20 caps for some god forsaken reason.

Contradicting with the other "Reason 5", Melee vendor was practically untouched and was only so when people started complaining about it, the same also went with other vendors that were apparently outdated.

 

On 7/15/2024 at 9:10 PM, Toni0 said:

6. This current economy is a failure at cutting down on people being rich. There are enough people I can count on 2 hands that have made hundreds of thousands of caps for their factions in just days of grinding. 

Not to name certain "Grinders" *ahem* Thaddeus... but I'm pretty sure they were going to start nerfing cores by setting limits to their vendors so players can't pull all-nighters on grinding for money. At the same time, an alternative could be to raise the tax on the player bank and fully implement a sort of Vendor Bank, wasn't that ANOTHER suggestion you had put out prior?

 

On 7/15/2024 at 9:10 PM, Toni0 said:

7. Mugging will feel more rewarding and the standard cap set of 3500 will feel better but not too bad for the person being mugged either.

PF/Mugging Cope Reason; Raising mugging level was already discussed and was proven that it's redundant, you're just giving devs more workload to fix a ton of shit which includes the slaving vendor system... again for the third time in a fucking row.

[Toni0]

On 7/20/2024 at 2:52 PM, ThunderWolf said:

ACTUALLY up before suggesting something such as this.

Yeah.... when its too late....

 

This economy was experimented with in several ways in an entire year and 3 wipes. It is a colossal failure with 0 room to grow, unrewarding looting, and boring mechanics. It will stay that way no matter what you do, and if it doesn't it will tire people out to grind even more. 

Public vendors have 0 room to grow due to the little spread in numbers, no matter what argument you make this economy is unstable and miserable to play, there is 1 meta and forever will be only one meta between farming as a core faction player or afk mindlessly gather materials for random shit. Looting is useless, reselling weapons to vendors relentlessly is useless, selling weapon frames and BPs is useless, everything is a pain. 

[Garrus]

On 7/20/2024 at 7:22 PM, Toni0 said:

Yeah.... when its too late....

 

This economy was experimented with in several ways in an entire year and 3 wipes. It is a colossal failure with 0 room to grow, unrewarding looting, and boring mechanics. It will stay that way no matter what you do, and if it doesn't it will tire people out to grind even more. 

Public vendors have 0 room to grow due to the little spread in numbers, no matter what argument you make this economy is unstable and miserable to play, there is 1 meta and forever will be only one meta between farming as a core faction player or afk mindlessly gather materials for random shit. Looting is useless, reselling weapons to vendors relentlessly is useless, selling weapon frames and BPs is useless, everything is a pain. 

[Marski]

On 7/20/2024 at 8:22 PM, Toni0 said:

Yeah.... when its too late....

 

This economy was experimented with in several ways in an entire year and 3 wipes. It is a colossal failure with 0 room to grow, unrewarding looting, and boring mechanics. It will stay that way no matter what you do, and if it doesn't it will tire people out to grind even more. 

Public vendors have 0 room to grow due to the little spread in numbers, no matter what argument you make this economy is unstable and miserable to play, there is 1 meta and forever will be only one meta between farming as a core faction player or afk mindlessly gather materials for random shit. Looting is useless, reselling weapons to vendors relentlessly is useless, selling weapon frames and BPs is useless, everything is a pain. 

[Haroxan]

Economy is being looked at for changes already for 4.0